YWAMKnowledgeBase:Meeting 20090729 (from 20090720)

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The meeting is held here: <skype action="chat">kevincolyerwork</skype> at 16h00 GMT+1.


You can put ideas here for what we want to talk about during the KB meeting. Anyone who wants to join in is welcome (put ~~~~: before your comment and you have the lead on that discussion!): (some or all of these)

  1. Publicity - follow up on stickers
  2. Knowledge Management article - need to do more here!
  3. Community - keep going
  4. Work days... - when and what will we do
  5. Adverts: suggest policy that this is not a valid reason for an article. Except that it adds some extra value (teaches a bigger principle, outlines syllabus, lists lots of schools etc.). The U of N catalogue is the place to find schools. "This is an advert for a school and does not contain any wider value than advertising the availability of the school. Please develop this page into something different and relevant to all YWAMers. This page should be deleted at a future point".
  6. Proposed next Meeting: Monday 24th August @ 16h00 GMT+1


Just so we manage to get some business done here are a few rules:

  1. Remember that a lot of attendees are writing in their second language - there fore ignore all unimportant spellings and also try to leave give more time for them to respond. Lets not 'shout' over the voices of others by bombarding people with messages.
  2. Try to stay on topic! Jokes and Red herrings are fun but probably not helpful in a chat context!
  3. The Chairman (today its Kevin) will set the topic. Try to follow it. TYPING THINGS IN CAPITALS IS THE CHAIRMANS WAY OF CALLING FOR ORDER.
  4. Voting: if asked to vote please vote +1 for yes and -1 for no. 0 or nothing is an abstention.
  5. Enjoy the meeting - you can have private chats with another person - just try to pay attention to the main flow of things too.


Please write your apologies here and any comments you wish to make but will not be able to. (Please sign by entering a --~~~~)


Please put your name here if you are planning on coming to the meeting.


Present: Apologies:

  • Accepted No Adverts policy - but want it to be human edged

Action points:

  • Stickers again next time
  • Going to look at KB articles needing Advert tag and add it
  • Arnoud: look at pretifing Advert tag by taking wikipedia code
  • Kevin: seek feedback on new skin and work out IE hacks to get it right before we impliment


[16:32:00] … STARTED
[16:32:16] Arnoud van Dillewijn: Good
[16:32:25] kevincolyerwork: Sorry about just not being there last time. Bad communication on my part
[16:33:29] Arnoud van Dillewijn: I wasn't there either.. bad me
[16:35:00] … So review.
[16:36:20] … I look at the page with the agenda for the meeting for today
[16:36:30] kevincolyerwork: It is basic.
[16:36:32] Arnoud van Dillewijn: Says something about stickers and other things
[16:36:43] kevincolyerwork: I think we did all the business from last meeting - you did my job
[16:36:52] … The stickers was getting costs for advert stickers
[16:37:28] Arnoud van Dillewijn: ah.. No idea. I haven't looked into stickers or advertisement.
[16:37:43] … The only thing I really like is the layout with the wave
[16:38:22] kevincolyerwork: Yes that is nice
[16:38:27] … It will please Saulo!
[16:38:35] Arnoud van Dillewijn: It could be a good idea to use a wave in the logo
[16:38:36] kevincolyerwork: (quite rightly!)
[16:38:55] … I wondered if we should have a tag line under the YWAM KnowledgeBase bit
[16:39:00] Arnoud van Dillewijn: I do use this layout now, although it is not perfect.. I do like the looks more
[16:39:12] kevincolyerwork: I have tested it a bit
[16:39:30] … It works well in Firefox, Konqueror (and probably Safari then), Chrome
[16:39:34] … BUT
[16:39:43] … Aweful in IE 6 (Who cares)
[16:39:50] … Poor in IE7 and IE8
[16:39:57] … But that might be correctable
[16:40:08] … Have you spotted anyother problems?
[16:43:14] Arnoud van Dillewijn: Sorry.. Doorbell
[16:43:52] … Yeah.. IE didn't work so well. But I have firefox
[16:44:11] … Oh, the only recent problem was with the mainpage..
[16:44:26] kevincolyerwork: ?
[16:44:32] Arnoud van Dillewijn: I put in the create box and I couldn't get the edit link to work again..
[16:45:01] … Malin arrived
[16:45:21] * Arnoud van Dillewijn invited malin.tangen
[16:45:37] kevincolyerwork: Welcome Mailn
[16:45:56] … I'll look in to it. It is probably due to using the wyswyg editor
[16:46:02] Malin Tangen: hi and thanks!
[16:46:24] Arnoud van Dillewijn: Yeah, probably it is. So let's go on with the next thing
[16:47:03] … Back to the stickers..?
[16:47:18] kevincolyerwork: brown and sticky sitckers
[16:47:31] … I think they just need costing. Neo was going to do the design
[16:48:14] Arnoud van Dillewijn: No sign from Neo yet.. we better ask him if he has something already..
[16:49:44] … Maybe we have some more news about that with the next meeting
[16:49:55] kevincolyerwork: OK - just asked him
[16:50:00] … (via email)
[16:50:15] Arnoud van Dillewijn: Good! That seems to work quite well
[16:50:20] kevincolyerwork: Do you think you can find a good print shop in Berlin?
[16:50:32] Arnoud van Dillewijn: Laterly quite overwhelmed with emails from the KB
[16:50:32] kevincolyerwork: Get some prices?
[16:50:43] … The emails are that good?!
[16:50:49] Arnoud van Dillewijn: For T-shirt I already know one
[16:50:54] kevincolyerwork: OK
[16:51:21] … To be honest if we are growing and you are working on people management and welcoming others then that is great!
[16:51:27] Arnoud van Dillewijn: No, I just keep on bothering people with messages that they can't escape the influence of the KB no more..
[16:51:33] kevincolyerwork: Stickers are suplemental!
[16:51:51] … We had two people want to leave the mailing list recently (but they had left YWAM)
[16:52:08] … But I was pleased to see some conversation flowing in the last few days!
[16:52:09] Malin Tangen: ok, so what else besides stickers??
[16:52:16] kevincolyerwork: Hi Malin
[16:52:24] … Have you tried the new Wiki Skin?
[16:52:24] Malin Tangen: Hi!
[16:52:33] Arnoud van Dillewijn: Yeah, I see people leave on the FB group too. That's quite okay.
[16:52:46] Malin Tangen: Nope, basically because I am not sure quite how it works... :(
[16:52:48] … ;)
[16:52:51] kevincolyerwork: OK
[16:52:58] … Go to My Preferences
[16:52:59] Malin Tangen: sorry!
[16:53:05] kevincolyerwork: Click Skins
[16:53:06] Arnoud van Dillewijn: Yeah.. it is easy..
[16:53:16] kevincolyerwork: choose fratman_enhanced
[16:53:27] … follow the instructions from there
[16:53:38] Malin Tangen: "save" or "reset"
[16:53:39] … ?
[16:53:43] Arnoud van Dillewijn: save
[16:54:04] … And than you look around a bit.. and see what changed
[16:54:43] … If right, than you see a nice wave on top of the page.. in the right YWAM KB blue..
[16:54:54] Malin Tangen: hmmm...
[16:55:02] kevincolyerwork: press ctrl+f5
[16:55:09] Malin Tangen: i have a mac!
[16:55:16] … :D
[16:55:22] kevincolyerwork: Its the same!
[16:55:25] … or just f5
[16:55:29] Malin Tangen: ohh, ok!
[16:55:35] kevincolyerwork: nice?
[16:55:50] Malin Tangen: sound effects, etc (?)
[16:55:58] kevincolyerwork: no
[16:56:31] Malin Tangen: ok, what was suppose to happen?
[16:56:47] Arnoud van Dillewijn: Malin, do you use Safari or Firefox?
[16:56:57] kevincolyerwork: your page would change to look differnt with a blue wave over the top
[16:57:08] Malin Tangen: firefox
[16:57:14] Arnoud van Dillewijn: Okay, that's good
[16:57:23] kevincolyerwork: CTRL+F5 then
[16:57:29] Malin Tangen: it has a blue wave-ish thing on the top
[16:57:32] kevincolyerwork: that's it!
[16:57:42] Malin Tangen: by the logo and going thorugh "ywam knowledge base"
[16:58:27] … honestly, first impression... it doesnt look "attractive", it looks kind of like "formal, boring, information sites" (know it might sound "not polite or nice thing to say", but want to be honest...)
[16:58:58] … than again, ywam kb is probably (??) mostly for ywamèrs
[16:59:04] Arnoud van Dillewijn: But compared to the other layout?
[16:59:58] kevincolyerwork: more boring or less boring
[17:00:27] Malin Tangen: I really like that theres more color, but the other lay-out was maybe less "serious".... I dont really know.... maybe it needs some time getting used to!
[17:00:48] kevincolyerwork: Thanks for being frank
[17:01:04] … I'd like to know what Saulo thinks
[17:01:16] … OK Next topic?
[17:01:21] Arnoud van Dillewijn: Very good. I like honesty too. I think it isn't perfect either. But already a bit improvent anyhow
[17:01:26] … Yep
[17:01:37] Malin Tangen: What is next topic??
[17:03:10] kevincolyerwork: ADVERTS
[17:03:20] Arnoud van Dillewijn: :)
[17:03:53] kevincolyerwork: What do you think of the proposal and the attempts I made today to create a template?
[17:04:07] Arnoud van Dillewijn: You have to show Malin...
[17:04:32] kevincolyerwork: http://ywamkb.net/kb/index.php/CRASH_COURSE
[17:04:39] … I put one on this page
[17:05:07] … you need to add a special tag to the page: {{Advert|July 2009}} or whatever the date is.
[17:05:55] Malin Tangen: hey, something has happened, I try to navigate around and I end up with "mozilla wiki"...
[17:06:05] … how do I get out if that, and back into ywam kb??
[17:06:17] kevincolyerwork: click on the link above
[17:06:25] Malin Tangen: i have
[17:06:35] … think i figured it out though... ;)
[17:07:21] … @kevin: "this page is considered an Advert...."
[17:07:27] … what does that mean??
[17:08:19] kevincolyerwork: Hopefully what it says. Is it not clear?
[17:09:17] Malin Tangen: yes, it is... sorry, was so confused about having "clicked" on different skins I got a bit caught up. Really good!! Absolutely agree with you!
[17:09:35] kevincolyerwork: Any improvements in wording?
[17:09:41] Malin Tangen: if not, kb could easily get "filled" with these things, so good work!
[17:09:51] … What you mean?
[17:09:57] kevincolyerwork: Does it show that we want to constructively move forward with whatever has been added?
[17:11:05] Arnoud van Dillewijn: I think we can remove the advert warning if we adjust the content a bit
[17:11:11] kevincolyerwork: exactly
[17:11:17] Malin Tangen: Yes, maybe not have "in this case a link to a resourse person" twice, but I dont really know if it means that much!
[17:11:47] kevincolyerwork: if someone removes the template link then we can see it in the logs and go and police it
[17:11:53] … put it back if needed
[17:11:53] Malin Tangen: I can adjust /re-do it, as I have talked some with Linn Iren about the next, which will be in May next year instead!
[17:12:23] kevincolyerwork: We should encourage her (and others) to write more about it so it can be multiplied.
[17:12:40] … I think helping people engage with the KB like this teaches them to multiply what they do
[17:13:03] Arnoud van Dillewijn: Multiply pioneer courses :)
[17:13:06] Malin Tangen: but what do you mean with "Link to a person" (e-mail, facebook-profile, phone-nr or a wiki-page about him/her???)
[17:13:52] kevincolyerwork: yes
[17:14:01] … some or all of those
[17:14:19] Malin Tangen: (ok, now you sound like my dad!! answering a single "yes" to a row of multiple questions!!!! :P )
[17:14:28] … Whats up with guys????
[17:14:33] … gosh!
[17:14:44] … ok, so "yest" to which one?
[17:14:48] kevincolyerwork: Well, it could be simple, complex, something in between or nothing
[17:14:54] … or the problem could be women???
[17:15:01] Malin Tangen: how dare you????
[17:15:04] kevincolyerwork: !!!
[17:15:06] … I dare!
[17:15:14] Malin Tangen: *sigh*
[17:15:23] … ok, I will take the challenge!!
[17:15:43] kevincolyerwork: I don't think the link to a person should be specified - there are lots of ways to connect
[17:15:52] Malin Tangen: lets go back to talking about ADVERTS!!!
[17:16:08] … - agree, link to schools /base e-mail adress or web-site
[17:16:34] kevincolyerwork: So If we are happy with the policy shall we all vote?
[17:16:36] … +1
[17:16:47] Malin Tangen: - or link to a kb-profile of the person (when people get more info about somebody, it might be easier to trust them - than again, what do you feel about "wiki-sites" about people???)
[17:17:00] kevincolyerwork: (+1 = fore -1 = against)
[17:17:13] Malin Tangen: +1
[17:17:18] … i have nothing against it
[17:17:39] … as long as it is expressed CLEARLY
[17:17:40] kevincolyerwork: @Malin - I think that's fine. I would expect people to need a deeper level of commuinication so they would work towards a phone chat or face to face
[17:17:56] Malin Tangen: ok, sweet!! :)
[17:18:09] Arnoud van Dillewijn: +1 No adverts.. but we need a gentle approach to encourage the people who make them. So some help to change their page in the right way
[17:18:15] kevincolyerwork: OK
[17:18:17] … AGREED
[17:18:21] … So.......................
[17:18:49] … Shall we work on this over the next hours and tag articles with the Advert tag. Do you know how to do that?
[17:19:41] Arnoud van Dillewijn: {{Advert|July 2009}} on top of the page
[17:19:59] kevincolyerwork: yep
[17:20:33] Arnoud van Dillewijn: Do we have more of these handy tools.. like wikipedia has?
[17:20:56] kevincolyerwork: a bot
[17:20:58] … no
[17:21:07] … becuase I don't know how to program them
[17:21:18] … manual for now
[17:22:08] Arnoud van Dillewijn: No no, not a bot.. just some help and suggestion lines. Like: this page needs a reference, or clean up.. etc.
[17:23:48] kevincolyerwork: that is a template - like the advert one. Theirs are prettier but we can grab their code and adapt it
[17:24:24] Arnoud van Dillewijn: Good good. I will look into wikipedia and learn from them. We might be apply them too
[17:24:29] … able
[17:24:49] kevincolyerwork: should. I think my advert template is ugly!
[17:24:56] … Any more points?
[17:25:02] … I have to go in 5 mins
[17:25:48] Arnoud van Dillewijn: Looks like we did some main things. Only thought I had was about the YWAM Europe page
[17:26:27] kevincolyerwork: ?
[17:26:35] Arnoud van Dillewijn: We don't want to duplicate. But this can be a really nice feature for some purpose
[17:27:51] … I am not sure what can of specific purpose.. to give a quick overview, or to link articles with specific bases..
[17:28:40] … Tell the history of YWAM there.. or a mix of all kinds of things..
[17:29:06] kevincolyerwork: Yes - it needs more than what is available from the go-manual etc.
[17:30:36] Arnoud van Dillewijn: Well, we can think about that still. Pray and ask God what direction to take.
[17:30:48] … And discuss it next time
[17:30:53] kevincolyerwork: So Malin - you have a lot of work there!
[17:31:10] Arnoud van Dillewijn: Haha.. just take it easy. 1 at a time..
[17:31:57] kevincolyerwork: OK
[17:32:00] … Thanks all.
[17:32:09] … Thanks to Arnoud for organising the day.
[17:32:14] … I am exhausted now
[17:32:20] … MEETING OVER